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Old 06-19-2007, 02:16 PM   #1
Ming
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What ever happened to Vanguard?

I played halfway through the beta and got frustrated at the slowness on my crappy machine. Seems like you just don't hear anything about this game, period. Did it massively flop?
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Old 06-19-2007, 02:35 PM   #2
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Massively Flop is an understatement. It's pretty much led to the end of The Brad's career as a lead designer.
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Old 06-19-2007, 03:32 PM   #3
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That's too bad. The beta was pretty cardboard bland as far as gameplay.
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Old 06-19-2007, 04:44 PM   #4
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had some good features but was released way before its time.
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Old 06-20-2007, 02:58 PM   #5
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Imho

Let's be fair...it sukt....there was little redeeming value to having more skills to work up...
I mean that's just another SW::Galaxies knock off... everything was far away to do Ala Anachy Online.... Plus, it looked like the other sony games. No thanks...

*shrug* I would be happier if an UPGRADED Superhero game was made...CoH is too simple...Vanguard is too...well sucky...and WoW...well WoW is just WoW...built in fan base always helps out.

I need something MORE! Keep my A.D.D. self entertained, not to mention ---

Sorry, what were we talking about?
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Old 06-20-2007, 09:51 PM   #6
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*whispers* .....e.....q....2.........

Autie seems to enjoy it!
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Old 06-21-2007, 01:04 AM   #7
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Here's what I'm playing currently (in no particular order):

1) http://www.eve-online.com/
- It's not your traditional MMO. Download the free trial and give it a try. I warn you though, the game will not "hold your hand" and walk you through it's content ala EQ1-2, WoW, AO, CoH, etc.. It's more of a free form environment. The article below may help. I play, Xion, Izzin...many others. You don't have to PvP, but it's damned fun.
http://www.eurogamer.net/article.php...d=77768&page=1

2) http://vanguard.station.sony.com
- If you've got a beefy enough machine, it's beautiful to play. The characters are all feel very well fleshed out in the mechanics and balanced well for PvE play. Despite the negativity it's not as bad as you've heard. It plays like EQ 1 with more bells and whistles. It's got some technical issues that are being resolved quickly now that SOE has taken ownership of the game and has added it to it's Station Pass lineup. I've got ZERO tolerance for games that suck. This one is fine. If you're looking for the next evolution in MMO play, you won't find it here. WoW is the best there is in this genre, to date.

3) http://battlefield.ea.com/battlefield/bf2142/
- You run around and shoot people. You shoot guns, rockets, tanks, aircraft, mounted weaponry, air strikes, grenades, the list goes on. I'm not a fan of the BF franchise overall, but this is the best one to date it seems. When I'm bored of the slower paced MMO's or nobody is on to group with, this is where I go.

4) http://planetside.station.sony.com/
- As an alternative to to BF 2142. It had SO much potential and just fell so short. I still have a love/hate with this game that I just can't let go of. I'm sure there's a free trial in there somewhere if you haven't already sampled it.
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Old 07-14-2007, 03:00 PM   #8
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I beta'ed Vanguard for a couple days prior to baby and for the most part it was a typical MMORPG. It was beta and so I didn't count the downtimes or the lagginess agasint it. In fact, for a beta it wasn't all that bad. I was really getting into the diplomacy thing. It was a sort of weird card game but very different and I liked it. Their crafting hall background noises sounded a porno, all the ohh's and ahh's. We did find the sucker was huge in terms of space it ate up! I wouldn't say it was horrible but there really wasn't much there to make me swap from EQ2.

Poor Brad, he's a great ideas man but he just won't stand for his Visions(TM) to be changed by other people. That seems to be death for an ongoing game with real people playing it.
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Old 07-17-2007, 02:04 PM   #9
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Diplomacy was fun until I got good at it (with any given character,) at which point it was just a chore to click the right stuff. "oh they're gonna use that? lemme just swap this card for that one and this one for that one." The result was always the same, you got what you came for and the diplomacy was a roadblock. Group play was a joke. Any mob just got completely annihilated within the first few rounds. Solo'ing multiple mobs was pretty fun with ranged tactics, ie snare, mez etc, or kiting deep reds, etc, but hell EQ one had all that and it was actually scary. I miss gaming so much. Damn.
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Old 07-31-2007, 01:43 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Croyd View Post
*shrug* I would be happier if an UPGRADED Superhero game was made...CoH is too simple...Vanguard is too...well sucky...and WoW...well WoW is just WoW...built in fan base always helps out.

I need something MORE! Keep my A.D.D. self entertained, not to mention ---

Sorry, what were we talking about?
Cryptic who made City of Heroes/Villians is working with Marvel on a new superhero game based in the Marvel Universe...

http://www.crypticstudios.com/index....d=82&Itemid=34

I don't know too much about it but they did a good job with COH/COV and some of the last issues like I10 have added significantly. I think they COULD make a stellar product especially knowing what they have learned from COH.
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Old 08-01-2007, 10:45 AM   #11
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Heya WW. Long time no see.
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Old 08-03-2007, 08:02 PM   #12
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Vanguard in Summary (And it ain't so brief).

So I got in Vanguard beta really early, back when most of the people were running around with dev gulids and such, and I would play on and off as time allowed, for actually over a year, never really playing that much at any given time. Come closer to release time I started playing it a bit more, and then come release I played it up to about level 45. This is just my view of what happened with the game, but I think it's fairly valid considering I was at least aware of all the shifts and such they did during beta.

So. The original goal of the game was to sorta recapture that holy crap this game is hard feeling of EQ1. No really easy go kill crap quests past the early levels, no little wispy thingers leading you exactly where you needed to go, none of that. The level grind itself and the leveling content would once again actually combat with raiding as the point of the game.

Well, it turns out, most people don't like that. So as the game went through beta it got progressively easier (level remapping, mob difficulty adjustments, adding of nonsense kill 10 thing quests, etc). When I first started beta I honestly struggled to go from level 11-12 in one day (remember your first character in EQ?). By the time beta was most of the way done, I could go from 1-17 in a day, easy.

Now, the game's motto was originally content is king. And to be fair, this game has a -ton- of content below level 35 or so. I played a bunch of characters from 1-20, and never ran out of novel things to do. Problem is, they made you go from 1-20 so fast that the time they spent developing those areas was essentially wasted.

Like all MMOs, this one was released before it was ready. By a lot. To this day, there is no raid content in the game that I'm aware of (granted I haven't played in a few months, but I still have the client). The level 40+ content almost all consisted of nothing but mindless faction grinds so you could then do quests for rewards. The item system was such that these quest rewards were really the only gear worth wearing. Mob dropped items were ok, but the quest rewards were where it was at. Player made gear for a while was great, but they started screwing with the not broken parts of crafting because people were making too much money with it and totally forgot to fix the parts that actually worked. I never did crafting, but every crafter I knew gradually quit after they hit level 35 or so, even the hardcore ones.

I personally thought the game play was solid. I played a bard and loved it. Had to be active as all hell to do your job well and if you had a good group you ripped through mobs at a decent clip. Regardless of what you think of the game play, which I'll admit was pretty standard for an MMO of this generation (and damn diplomacy, what idiot thought that system was going to be interesting should be shot, I never even tried it...) the above info totally damned the game.

On release your fairly hardcore crowd absolutely level blitzed as always happens. Problem is usually the crowd is racing to -something- and in this game once they hit 50 the only thing they could really do was roll another character and do it all over again. So those folks quit. The people that played slower would go up in level, etc. then do the same thing. Hit 40+, realize there wasn't much to do, and stop playing. Once that trend gets started, it's a freaking floodgate. Your friends quit and you no longer have anyone to group with, and you quit. The lack of endgame content just resulted in a massive purge of anyone that invested the time to get to the higher levels. Server population plummets, it because increasingly difficult to find a group, and even more people quit. Pile that on top of the fact that you lose subscribers to the usual things (ie, game too buggy, I like X MMO better...) and the game dies.

Now, I'm pretty sure this is the way that alot of other MMOs have worked in the past. The problem is, there's -so- much competition out there these days that if you don't realease a great game, people are just going to go back to what they were playing before. Because the game originally was labeled hardcore only and then the game failed to capture that audience in addition to never really capturing the people they changed the game for, it was a miserable failure.

Like I said, I loved playing my bard. I can honestly say that I had more fun playing more bard in groups than any character in any other MMO I've ever played. Problem was, towards the end, there was no one to group with and nothing to do even if you could group. No matter how good of a job they had done with gameplay, which is arguable, the sheer lack of content post 40 and the ease with which players got to that level absolutely destroyed the community which is the foundation of any MMO which requires group play.

And yes. I am bored enough to write this. I'm not playing any MMOs ^_^

Btw, anyone seen Neero?!

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Old 08-08-2007, 05:15 PM   #13
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Great read.
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Old 08-24-2007, 07:31 AM   #14
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It's been quite a while... very good read and an even greater assessment of Vanguard. I can't picture my toon, but I played on Tharridon (PvP FFA Server) and hit level 45 and quit. I was playing with about 8 other friends, which gradually grew smaller and smaller, and by that time, no one wanted to play anymore.

There was still a lot of PvE content that we hadn't covered or explored, but it was meaningless to now. Among quests for 30 slot bags or something like that in the 45s+ area, I could care less to try with my group of 5. I was also a shadowknight iirc.

I have to agree Neodios, that there was a lack of raid content and endgame stuff to kill. They also spent too much time on content from levels 1-35, cause they assumed players would take a little while to level so this would give them buffer time to update content for higher levels.

Too bad, there was some sort've level exploit with bards AE snare, fears, and a wizzy nuking it all. I guilded a wizard who I met; seemed like a nice guy; was level 36. Literally 7 hours later, he was 43. 9 hours later, he was 48. Then he was banned (I assume cause he never logged back on and the website guild stats showed he wasnt in my guild anymore).

So that's definite proof of some type of exp exploit which I personally saw after these guys' 5v1'd ganked me when I was soloing. I ran back to get my grave, saw them exploiting, took screenshots, reported to GM, 4 got banned (or never logged back on), 5th guy quit (I saw him on a couple times) from what I heard.

Not sure how long you played Neo, but there were too many money farmers and suddenly items inflated x100 fold; no joke. Prior to that, I had about 4plat with 2-3 mules and 4pp was considered rich. I would buy items and resell them at a higher price (legal market niche). Farmers killed it though and 4pp became tipjar-fodder.

I got an email recently from VG saying theyre merging their 13 servers into 4 so that should say something about how bad the game tanked. It was released way too early and I honestly feel Shadowbane is the only game out there that had EQ1 potential, but lacked funding/development.
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Old 08-28-2007, 02:46 PM   #15
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Update and some comments!

Yeah, basically same exact thing happened with me Ravn. I was around 45ish, the one group I leveled with consistently all got bored around the same time, and once one of us quit it didn't take long for the rest of us to go. I think that's really a danger with MMO communities in general these days though. Same thing happened to me in EQ2.

As for the cash on Tharridon. I had a little cleric on Tharridon and stopped in there the other day. Talked to an old friend from beta who is also the DK class lead. It's not that the gold farmers got that much gold. It's that they let a plat dupe slip for a while. Some servers were hit way harder than others. On Tharridon items cost about 5 times as much as they do on my server (Woefeather). A little over 1pp still buys you the best player made weapon in the game on my server, so. And the bug you mentioned about leveling, there were a couple versions of those. For a while they missed one in Southwatch with missives that let you level insanely quickly and people that were doing it were simply rolled back. That's nothing particularly new though, CoH had it's fire tanks and caltrops around corner whoring, for example.

When they announced the server merge and after I took a break from the game I decided to go back and start playing again. The game still has largely the same issues, the high level content is mostly a faction/items for faction farm. A lot of people have actually done the same. Server population is a up a bit because of the announced merge, and the merge is actually taking place right now. I still really enjoy playing my character, and oddly enough while I wasn't playing they made my bard even better. Fell in with another small but high level guild. I'll be on Xeth as Jayko if anyone is interested, just shoot me a mail in game. I still think this game has a lot of potential, and with the revitalizing of the community, who knows.

*edit* Because of the server merge they're offering server transfers so that people can hook up with friends. Can transfer from PVP to non PVP but not vice versa. Since I'm on a non-pvp server if anyone had a character and still wants to play but doesn't know anyone on their server can transfer to Xeth and at least that's one person you know

-Neo

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Old 08-28-2007, 09:59 PM   #16
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Some CLAW still playing on Targonor now seradon. Here is the thread about server merge's http://www.c-l-a-w.org/forums/showthread.php?t=3971

Crazdem is one playing from time to time.
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